Amazon Issues Refund on PS3 'Other OS' Removal
20% for withdrawal of advertised feature
Sony's removal of the ability to install and use an 'Other OS' on the PS3 in its recent update has resulted not only in a backlash, but also a partial refund to a console-owning, consumer-law savvy, Neogaf poster.
'GAF Forum moderator Iapetus, invoked EU Directive 1999/44/EC (which is supported in the UK by the The Enterprise Act 2002 and The Sale and Supply of Goods to Consumers Regulations 2002). This directive states that good sold:
"show the quality and performance which are normal in goods of the same type and which the consumer can reasonably expect, given the nature of the goods and taking into account any public statement of the specific characteristics of the goods made about them by the seller, the producer or his representative, particular in advertising or on labelling."
Iapetus, being aware of his rights invoked the directive in a question to Amazon about their policy given that his PS3 had been gimped. In his own words he:
"Pointed them at the relevant EU directive, pushed back when they tried to point me at their 30-day guarantee, and that was it. I hadn't even asked for any refund - just what their policy was going to be on such things. No idea how they calculated the refund - it's about 20%, I think."
That 20% was in fact £84 (Item Refund: £71.49 Item Tax Refund: £12.51) according to his posting.
Also quoted in the thread, as a related topic is what appears to be an flat-out denial from a Mr Geoffrey Levand at Sony Computer Entertainment from August 2009 that states:
"Please be assured that SCE is committed to continue the support for previously sold models that have the
'Install Other OS' feature and that this feature will not be disabled in future firmware releases."
This quote has also caused some frustration and then apocalyptic outrage on the Official US PlayStation blog late last month. Consumer law in that part of the world operates differently you see.
Cheers to PlayStationUniversity.
'GAF Forum moderator Iapetus, invoked EU Directive 1999/44/EC (which is supported in the UK by the The Enterprise Act 2002 and The Sale and Supply of Goods to Consumers Regulations 2002). This directive states that good sold:
"show the quality and performance which are normal in goods of the same type and which the consumer can reasonably expect, given the nature of the goods and taking into account any public statement of the specific characteristics of the goods made about them by the seller, the producer or his representative, particular in advertising or on labelling."
Iapetus, being aware of his rights invoked the directive in a question to Amazon about their policy given that his PS3 had been gimped. In his own words he:
"Pointed them at the relevant EU directive, pushed back when they tried to point me at their 30-day guarantee, and that was it. I hadn't even asked for any refund - just what their policy was going to be on such things. No idea how they calculated the refund - it's about 20%, I think."
That 20% was in fact £84 (Item Refund: £71.49 Item Tax Refund: £12.51) according to his posting.
Also quoted in the thread, as a related topic is what appears to be an flat-out denial from a Mr Geoffrey Levand at Sony Computer Entertainment from August 2009 that states:
"Please be assured that SCE is committed to continue the support for previously sold models that have the
'Install Other OS' feature and that this feature will not be disabled in future firmware releases."
This quote has also caused some frustration and then apocalyptic outrage on the Official US PlayStation blog late last month. Consumer law in that part of the world operates differently you see.
Cheers to PlayStationUniversity.
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Comments
bertybassett 9 Apr 2010 12:25
1/8
Keep up the pressure lads Sony will soon back down if we keep it up.
Daz 9 Apr 2010 14:43
2/8
is it really that hard to set your PC to dual boot? that you NEED Linix on your PS3? call me crazy but I got a PS3 for games and Blu-Rays I don't even use it's Internet browser, not just because it's s**t either but because I have a PC for that stuff
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alexh2o 9 Apr 2010 16:18
3/8
@Daz
The point though is although you may not use the feature, some do and it was sold to them as having that feature. As you say, you use yours to play Blu-rays, and Im sure that was an aspect that persuaded you to buy one. If tomorrow Sony turned round and said in the next firmware update the playback of Blu-rays will be disabled, would you maintain the same point of view?
The point though is although you may not use the feature, some do and it was sold to them as having that feature. As you say, you use yours to play Blu-rays, and Im sure that was an aspect that persuaded you to buy one. If tomorrow Sony turned round and said in the next firmware update the playback of Blu-rays will be disabled, would you maintain the same point of view?
Daz 9 Apr 2010 17:54
4/8
not really, I have Blu-Rays 'because' it plays them, If they took playback out, I'd would be pretty upset but I'd just go get a blu-ray player, which I've actually been planning to do for awhile now as it can't be healthy for PS3 to be on for the amount of time I spend watching blu-rays and DVD's (among other things I can't fall asleep without the TV being on) I do get why people are upset but I'm sure someone pointed out somewhere in the EULA or whatever that Sony can do pretty much whatever they want with the PS3.
headcasephil 10 Apr 2010 10:24
5/8
Daz wrote:
not really, I have Blu-Rays 'because' it plays them, If they took playback out, I'd would be pretty upset but I'd just go get a blu-ray player, which I've actually been planning to do for awhile now as it can't be healthy for PS3 to be on for the amount of time I spend watching blu-rays and DVD's (among other things I can't fall asleep without the TV being on) I do get why people are upset but I'm sure someone pointed out somewhere in the EULA or whatever that Sony can do pretty much whatever they want with the PS3.
but what happens if you got your ps3 as a blu ray player. many people got there ps3 as a linux box hay iv got a 40 gb that sits in my mame cab so i can play mame on linux and my ps3 fighting games from 1 unit now i cant play online street fighter iv with out an update but that meens i cant play mame so i have to build a pc for it now which sucks big amounts as that means iv got 2 units in the cab more power buttons more switches for controllers more cables for video more cables for sound (MORE F**KING MONEY !!!)
Daz 10 Apr 2010 12:09
6/8
Like I said, I do get it, but whether you believe it or not Sony where well within their rights to disable "Other OS"
Matt. 10 Apr 2010 14:32
7/8
@Daz Sony are certainly within their rights to update the PS3 as they see fit, certainly. I don't think that will be challenged in court. But when certain stores such as Amazon sold PS3s with installing Linux as one of the advertised features, for that feature to now not work is actually a violation of EU law, hence the monetary refund. The law can't force Sony to re-enable 'Install Other OS'. You are quite right, and that is Sony's choice. Similarly if they disabled the Blu Ray capabilities, despite it being advertised as a key feature of the console then people would be entitled to a partial refund under the law.
One example of this is certain server farms use PS3s explicitly because of their cell capabilities and networking power. Whilst they are unlikely to be unaffected as they never ever will use PSN or the PS3 OS, they are now prohibited from updating that if they want to retain their server. Sony are not in the legal wrong here, it's just quite problematic for certain people, hence the refunds.
FYI: I've got a PS3 slim, so I never had a choice ;)
One example of this is certain server farms use PS3s explicitly because of their cell capabilities and networking power. Whilst they are unlikely to be unaffected as they never ever will use PSN or the PS3 OS, they are now prohibited from updating that if they want to retain their server. Sony are not in the legal wrong here, it's just quite problematic for certain people, hence the refunds.
FYI: I've got a PS3 slim, so I never had a choice ;)
Dreadknux 12 Apr 2010 11:15
8/8
Correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't believe any of Sony's PS3 packaging actually mentions Linux, or the ability to use OtherOS. If that's the case, then Sony doesn't have any obligations whatsoever.
However, retailers such as Amazon that do state the OtherOS functionality on their webpages will have to comply with whatever legal requirement is expected of them. So if refunds are to be given out for 'false' advertising, that deal lies with the retailers and not Sony.
However, retailers such as Amazon that do state the OtherOS functionality on their webpages will have to comply with whatever legal requirement is expected of them. So if refunds are to be given out for 'false' advertising, that deal lies with the retailers and not Sony.