Sony Coy on PSP Pricing Shuffle

Indeed they do, however, this thread is mainly to do with the performance of the PSP, not the performance of the PSP compared to the DS.

If the PSP has gathered 22-24% of the Japanese hand-held market, as the figures I quoted say it has, then it is a very viable platform and not a "gaming Titanic" as Joji initially called it.

Nobody has ever said that in Japan the DS was not outselling the PSP by a huge amount. However, that has nothing to do with the issue at hand. The Ford Focus outsells the Mazda MX-5 by a huge amount in the UK, this does not prevent the MX-5 being a very successful car.

Put it this way; how many other consoles have entered the portable market and taken 24% of it away from Nintendo? Umm, none that I can think of.

My argument wasn't whether DS was beating PSP in sales or not. There's no point arguing facts (unless they're wrong. :P). My issue was with the way this was debated in, which was a very 'Nintendo fanboy/Sony is evil/Sony deserve s**t on their faces' stance.

I agree with you Joji, but my point was simply that Sony deserve a little bit of credit for selling as many consoles as they have. Some people seem to take the view that Sony are trying to monopolise the handheld market (which is a joke). Some seem to think that the DS is beating the PSP by much more than it actually is (which was denied by tyrion's actual facts).

Sony do need to stick their thumb out though, and I'm thinking 'will a price drop make much of a difference?'. Perhaps not. I agree, I love the import PSP scene, even though there's not many AAA titles out in Japan, for some reason many titles there seem a lot more interesting than European releases. Heh, wonder why that is? I think Sony do need to focus more on their actual gaming output, because until now they appear to have taken the "oh, it's out there, let the third parties do what they want with it" attitude. Like Nintendo has with the DS, Sony needs to lead by example, and Loco Roco was a very good example. They just need to keep it up, but something smells of 'laurel-resting'.

My beef was more against Nintendo fanboyism in general, lol. Good Christ, when will they ever shut up.

No, they are names to allude to a hideous disaster. If you believe that capturing 22% of the Japanese market and over 50% of the European and US one is a disaster, you're fooling yourself. But your not fooling us.


You may have a point, but it's a massively mistaken one.

The competition is sponsored by Zoo Digital to promote Premier Manager - a title that is only available on PS2 and PC. The prize is the game, and something on which to play it - hence PS2, not PSP.

It's simple when you think about it...

I think he meant, David aka DS(weaker N64 graphics and sound, so called gimmick touch screen, better games in its sling) vs Goliath aka PSP (taller from market share, stronger from graphics, sound and god like sexy design, with a huge sword laced with widescreen and media capabilities).

''Who will win? Round One...! Fight

The rest is history.

Hypocrisy? We are all hypocrits then, just being in this very forum, posting and airing our views, then buying games and complaining about them. That is a thick brush word you are using, sir. Try again.

I said this several times before. We all make mistakes, we are not perfect for we are only human. Advice and feedback help us avoid the errors of days past. Nintendo, Sony and MS have all taken a slice of error pie and humble pie too. Indeed we want games and a better industry but no man is a saint or angel.

I reserve my right to voice my opinion on any of them three good or bad how I see it, agree or disagree, its up to you.

Slating your enemy in error or not, doesn't mean you want them dead, you know. I'm a keen Liverpool F.C fan and I slate Chelsea everyday, despite my knowing that they are a rubbish side with good players (what some call a good team in other words), but at the end of the day I still respect them, regardless of my calling them every name under the sun. The same attitude works in the games industry with Nintendo, Sony etc from game fans and there's nothing wrong with that. Just try to see the sunlight after the rain.

I'll still watch a Chelsea, Arsenal game etc because overall, I love and respect football. I'll still play any game put in front of me by Sony, Nintendo etc, because overall I love and respect games and those that make them.

The reason I slate PSP is because of the DS gimmick chants and for gone conclusion that Sony would come out on top by many, because they owned the home console industries arse. In short I just using my bragging rights (like when Liverpool beat the Chelski scum on Sunday, and the 2005/06 Champion League too).

Belief is a powerful thing, and I still believe PSP is a Titanic sinking slowly. How Sony try to turn things around will be the making of them, but they are doing little to change my mind overall. I still respect Sony though.

You are entitled to your opinion and you are entitled to voice it as you wish. However when your opinion is not backed by facts, you are going to get challenged on it.

When you ignore facts that disprove you and keep posting your opinion, people are going to get upset.

If you accuse others of bias when they are posting based on facts you are going to catch some flack.

When you respond to that flack by saying you are entitled to your opinion, you are going to look like an idiot.

Your choice how to proceed.

Realise the following facts before you post again.

Fact 1 The only market where DS is massively outselling PSP is in Japan.

Fact 2 In Japan the PSP currently holds a 22% share of the hand-held market.

Fact 3 In the US, the DS and PSP have sold a very similar amount of hardware.

Fact 4 In the US, the PSP outsold the DS in January, February, March, April and May this year.

Fact 5 In the UK, the DS only outsold the PSP in software sales after the Lite launched.

Fact 6 In the UK, the PSP currently accounts for 37% of hand-held software sales.


22% of the Japanese hand-held market, 37% of the UK hand-held market, parity with DS in the States. What you believe is wrong.

Answer me this, true believer; why when Nintendo are being squeezed out of the console market is it OK because they are still making money, but when Sony gain a respectable share of the hand-held market they are doomed because they haven't dominated?

Only one reason. Bias!

Lol......Jeez chill out man.

I don't have to back up everything with facts. I'm saying what I think.

Okay Stato, if you wanna rely on facts, also tell me what games PSP owners are buying, enough to justify your stance behind what you see as the alpha and omega of handhelds? Facts do not tell you everything or predict the future.

Is the fact the DS is doing so well, against the every other fact in Sony's favour, when many were relying on those same previous facts and stats for Sony to come first, say enough that you shouldn't always rely on them and put all your eggs in one basket? Tell me I'm wrong on this too then.

So tell me what are PSP owners buying game wise globally? Are they actually buyiing any games at all? And if so what are they buying that's gonna save Sony and PSP? Answer those please...

You sir, are quite beside yourself if you think Fifa games, GTA clones and PS2 ports are enough to justify the PSP high sales and save Sony's arse.

What is ther reason to be biased ?

Unbiased view is not only to take market share in account, but also (if you are not living in communism, like I've lived for more than half of my life):

> marketing budget
> hardware manufacturing cost - hardware price
> targeted share
> software shares
> company net profit from hardware/software sales

From unbiased (eg shareholder or analyst) point of view...

SONY PSP is complete disaster
NINTENDO DS is unprecedented success

From my biased view as a gamer...

SONY PSP disapointment (I've sold it recently)
NINTENDO DS [Lite] very pleasant surprise (I've bought it recently)

There are more PS1 ports if anything actually. [/facetious]


So was I, but you called me a hypocrite because I said Sony wasn't exactly doing piss poor. The difference is, when there's a difference of opinion, you can only logically go with the one that makes more sense. Saying the PSP is a sinking titanic doesn't make sense, because the analogy is incorrect. The sales figures to support that analogy aren't true.

Now, you're quite free to say what you like and voice your opinion, whether its factually based or not. But your problem is you chose to engage in a debate/discussion/difference in opinion with that opinion. And if you go into a debate with an opinion that you admitted yourself wasn't factually accurate, you're only going to look silly. A discussion or debate requires facts. You don't exactly have the right to get irritated just because you lost out on that factor.


That's like asking what games XBOX owners were buying 18 months ago. We never said the PSP was the be-all and end-all, and we never said the DS was the be-all and end-all. In fact, truth be told, we've been completely objective the whole time.


I don't believe any one of us predicting the future with any of our facts. They were simply to support the fact that the PSP hasn't been selling terribly outside Japan - something you fought against. Whether the PSP will sink or be successful in the future wasn't even touched upon, by you or us (apart from your titanic comments)


I'm not really sure what you're trying to say here anyway. From what I gather, you're saying that the reason tyrion is spewing these old facts is to drill the idea that the PSP is the #1 handheld. It's not. It's simply to say the PSP hasn't sold as terrible as you thought it has.

So yeah, you're wrong on that too then.


I'm sure, since it was said that software sales were quite good for PSP up until recently, that a few examples can be drawn. No doubt Liberty City Stories would have been one of them.


If you actually read the last 7 pages, you'll know that we never actually expressed blind faith in the PSP to score knockout sales. In fact, we've been lambasting the handheld simply for having too many ports. Hell, one of my response posts to one of yours even agrees with you for most of what you said! And I agree with this bit too.

But you're saying we believe the PSP is some kind of wonder machine. No we don't. We believe the PSP is given less credit than is due for actually managing to sell as many consoles as it has. And we certainly know that the PSP hasn't sold that many fewer units than the DS in the West. We've said this many times but you've clearly either misread or ignored it.

If you're so bothered by re-reading the same facts posted over and over again, stop spouting the same old crap that fanboys usually say.

But it's not unbaised is it? Sony PSP is a disappointment, I'll guarantee that. But it's not even close to being a complete disaster.

Put it this way - those who are saying it's a complete disaster are basically the ones who thought the PSP was going to kill the DS and render Nintendo helpless. It wasn't going to happen. Because your own unrealistic goals and thoughts on the PSPs performance wasn't met when the actual sales figures came along, you now make unrealistic claims that the PSP failed to do what it was meant to do.

This is what I mean by hypocritical. You worry the PSP will kill Nintendo, or advocate it. When it doesn't sell well, you say "well it's a complete failure then". I don't ever remember ~500,000 less units than the #1 being a complete failure (read tyrion's US sales comparison).

There are facts on page 2. Facts. Save yourself the embarrassment.

To answer you questions posed Tyrion, I'd have to say Sony don't need to dominate existing in the handheld market should be enough, many had already decided this would happen (cue that humbie pie in oven). I won't deny I don't want them to take the market share, because then I'll probably play and games less. A Nintendo absence would put me off a lot if they did exit.

Indeed Nintendo have dominated in this area for a long time, with practices I hated a lot too, (lack of GBA game price cuts, etc). Every king, knight or pawn have their pros and cons, its up to the people who they choose to rule. I don't always agree or disagree with Sony, MS or Nintendo. I just know which side my bread is better buttered on game and handheld wise and that's with Nintendo, that I truly believe.

Facts and odds are like the wind, always changing, enough that you'd never stake your life on them. To blindly place faith in them is stupid (in business I understand it to a degree though, but this is a forum). I don't blindly support Nintendo or Liverpool, when either is s**t I'll make a point of saying so. Same with Sony or MS. I don't blindly buy every DS game because some are crap too. If the DS was doing badly I'd still play the games because they have heart and at heart I'm a gamer. Good lord, I still play my PSone because of the sweet games that had, so I don't know where you are getting that bias biz from. I have a few consoles which I keep, because I love games and to throw or bin them would be stupid.

If we all blindly believe in facts we'd buying every single game and because of PR print, because they say its good, it must be true then, musn't it?

There's what you like most (I feel no shame like some in saying I like Nintendo, Capcom and Sega games) there's what you think (my opinions are usually based on what I see, not what someone tells me to see all the time) and what you feel and believe (I do believe the industry is better with Nintendo leading because other hand will lead to a bad tailspin of slow death, but I also see Sony's and MS efforts are justified and appreciated still, because I, like them can be wrong too ((I once didn't want MS in but I'm still gonna by a 360, because i want one)), I'm only human just like them).

Like I said before I enjoy all my consoles and games, but I don't see PSP recovering without some serious surgery (feel free to pick up the gaunlet Sony). The facts do not tell you everything, try to see with better eyes than that what you are using (or don't, its up to you).

If your facts are correct (or not) and Sony are in the lead (fair play to that, whatever), but the PSP still has hills to climb in correcting its problems. TV ads, good games etc.

Camaraderie double standard bias (Sony is crap, I hate them and love them) or serious deep thought (I do still believe Sony are in trouble with PS3 and PSP)? Its hard to divide the two, but be it football or gaming I'll use both. Its up to you to decipher which I'm using if I don't tell you myself.

A pinch of salt and throw caution to the winds of change, good people.

Its been fun, thanks once again.

Ok, you haven't read my post en bloc. So I'll repeat
About complete disaster / success...

You are still showing same numbers (for you probably don't have any other data or don't want to see them).

So there are three groups of relevant people.


1. PEOPLE WHO DON'T CARE AT ALL

2. PEOPLE FAMILIAR WITH MARKET (shareholders, businessman, analysts) OTHER THAN GAMERS

Taking into account everything that matters for a company like SONY or NINTENDO (costs, marketing budget, targeted sales and market share in relation to previous customer base and brand popularity, and mostly, estimates), PSP is indeed disaster and DS is indeed a success.

You can show your (out of context) numbers again and again but it will change nothing.

3. GAMERS

This is the place where there are different opinions possible.

Any conclusions cannot be deducted strictly from marketshare (SONY brand, it's marketing machine, it's customer base is easy ground to persuade somebody to buy nice looking and in fact sofisticated machine withou any previous deep reflection).

My (probably biased) opinion here is based on two facts..

a) I've had one year experience with PSP and I was disapointed, I have two months DS and I'm very pleased

b) After one year history for both consoles, Sony PSP despite its side advantages (advantages not related to quality of product itself) is loosing ground and DS precisely oposite

So this is it and you can show me "facts" again.

Well put there by Rudo?

So tyrion can you tell me the last time you saw a PSP ad on tv, when Sony are usual very good at selling there game on tv? I watch a lot of tv and I haven't seen one on u.k tb in ages. And you stand there and tell me Sony are not in trouble with PSP.

Dude, what have you been smoking? You are buying into Sony's hype that they aren't in trouble, when they clearly are, no matter what the stats and facts say.

PSP is a failure, get used to this clear fact, no matter what numbers and facts you are looking at.

Are you a shareholder in Sony or Nintendo?
Are you an an analyst?

So how do you know? Instead of offering us the cool assessment of an analyst, you offer us fiery rhetoric.


Fanboys are funny.


But, it's not actually unprecedented is it? There was the Game Boy and the Game Boy Advance before it, both precedents for Nintendo success in the handheld market.

My opinion is right, and facts are wrong!!!!!!!!!!111111!!!!!!!!

Fanboys are funny.

wow... you three are just begging for carple tunnel ;)

Heres an odd observation... you know how you brits keep complaining about all those pesky chavs that are taking over the place? You also knwo how the psp is sellign better than the DS over there? Also how the top games are sports games and GTA? And how the psp sells equally to the DS in the US and we have a fair percentage of wana be gangsters? and how japan doesnt have such issues and how the DS is litteraly mopping the floor with the psp in japan right now?

We aren't market analyists, we arent High level game company executives (well unless you want to count Dee and tyrion, i dunno if a game news sight classifys but you knwo what i mean) we are gamers. The sort of gamers who preffer our games to have blue skies and green fields. Interestign and imaginitive stories. We probably all prefer to be an elf in a tunic or an avenging son of a fisherman then some blinged out ghetto banger.

The world of media is over run with horrible crap. Music, movies, and even games are constantly beign s**t on by those who try to cater to this most awful of audiences. When sony anounced the psp a great many peopel saw the end of the road for nintendo (and with them the most classic of games). To see the DS doing so well now warms my bitter old sonic the hedgehog loveing heart.

This is about fun winning out over style in an industry most where convinced was going the way of popular music. The DS and now the Wii represent a second gameing renesance to many (16bit era beign the first i feel). When a giant like sony and its shiny trendy slick marketable device stumble even a bit, we cheer.

I love my xbox and my shooters dearly, but nothing would make me happier than to see the Wii outsell the lot of em. I'd like to believe that there are enough human beings left in the world who are more concerned about quality than image to put something like the Wii or the DS on top.

As rediculous as it sounds, with all that is so messed up in the world today seeing people flocking to the nintendo products makes me happy. Not because its nintendo, they are after all just a company, but because of the kind of products and services that nintendo are offering.

Most thought MS joining the game industry was a horrible thing but no one can deny that thay have gone way above and beyond to try and offer their customers the most worth while experience possible. Because thats how they make money. Its capitalism working the way it should, with the customers regulating the corporations.

or perhaps i read to much into this ;)
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