More Cell performance claims emerge

LUPOS, about 80% of those points would be sorted out if they bought the f**king PC they think they've got!!

not argument there... i know what i bought... im happy with it... its go good games... and no word processor.. there for it is a game machine... as promissed. Go forward however M$ are free and clear to make whatever new promises they want.

and for refference i think most of the things ont here are stupid... it is from xbox.com for cuks sake, but i just wanted to illustrate that M$ folliwng your "natural progression" and giving the peopel what they want doesn't equal up do bad business or bad video games. I know why dont you guys make a seperat section on your forum where you can post info about all the bad thing M$ does to the computer industry, and when the video games and computer markets finaly do end up being one... you can stick em back together... hell why don't you guys make a whole other web site devoted to compter information! you can talk about how M$ has ruined computers over there... and then come over to this section and prase them for: a)having the forsight to buy what is now one of the most sucessfull developers in history (bungie) b)getting an exlusive deal with team ninja c)making the best hardware available and offering it at a more than resonable price d) maintaining excellent relations with third party publishers e) creating a huge market share forthem selves after everyone (including yoursaelves probably) thought the xbox was going to be crap as soon as it was anounced.

It probably burns your ass that M$ has managed to make a good well built machine that sold well and has a ton of quality games on... are you going to tell me you didn't play ninja gaiden because windows only worked on a computer with dos on it instead of the generic dos.

i played ico... i loved everyminute of it... i play katamri darmacy every chance i get... infact i baught it for a friend of mine for christmas cause she has a ps2 and i don't... mainly so i coudl play it : )

If you want to talk about M$'s computer issues then do it, but do it in the right place at the right time... not while reporting info about a game console... keep your preconcieved notions out of my news.

or you know what you could report the potential issues that coudl arrise... let me give you an example:

"some people believe that M$ are planing on pushign the xbox as the center of home entertainment convergence in order to get into the large home entertainment market and also give themselves the perfect in for digital distribution. (i.e. mp3's)"

and then in a seperate article

"sony have anoyonced plans to release a digital media distribution software in the comming months. the ass yet unnamed service is deisgned to compete directly with Apple's ipod. It has long been reumored that sony was going to enter the digital distribution market, witht he recent purchase of (whatever the hell movie studio it is the own) and there large role in the development of the new blu-ray technology it apears that sony is indeed taking a stab at apples incredibly think armor."

there... except you guys woudl write it more like a normla person... maybe throw in a joke or a pop culture refference... per haps a snide comment ... but you would be faire... i like facts... i want your opinions on video games not corporate busines practices, and i dont think im alone in saying so.

Now just to be sure... there is no peronal insult ment by any of the conversation and i am not attempting to instigate an argument, if i come off as an ass its only mildly on purpose. In general i love the sight and the stories and the reviws and the archives. You guys (spong team) are each a welth of info and collectively a wonderfull assest to the gaming comunity. Its just unfortunate that you have kind of a bad rep because of things like this.


they say people who ramble have low self esteem because they dont have confidence in their words to acuratly deliver their message... well... at least im not full of myself.
______

That was my point LUPOS, you were laying the threat of world domination at Sony's feet, where it can't possibly be layed. They don't have enough control over the new tech to make good on your fears.

I know where you are coming from in the "monopoly on CPUs" stakes, but I just can't see it happening. There's a reason why Intel are the no.1 manufacturer of CPUs. That's the PC and more specifically PCs running Windows. I can't see MS jumping ship to Cell, it's never going to be a big PC CPU and the other uses for it are more suited to a lighweight OS like some of the embedded Linux variants.


If all you want is video games news with no speculation, slant, bias, analysis or discussion of the implications on the wider world, why don't you just read some press release re-writing site?

If you want to read our analysis of the news, read our site. If you don't agree with our analysis, say so right here. Just don't bitch if we come on here and try to explain why we disagree with you.

We try to bring all of our experience, in other markets to bear on our games news. We try to put games into a wider world, not just report on only the games market.

If you ignore the world outside of the games market, you will miss a lot of why many people think Microsoft is so evil, you will miss a lot of why many people round the world consider Sony a quality-product producer.

To complain that we relate games to the wider world ON A GAMES SITE (the horror) is a bit narrow minded and harkens back to the "alone in the bedroom" style of playing games, where young, disillusioned youth separated themselves from reality because they had no connection to the outside world.


Everyone else has to analyse the market, plan a strategy and make a decent product that can compete in that market.

Microsoft jumps in with a PC in a box, lies about their future plans and throws money at hardware, developers and customers until its platform is accepted.

Which one do you think deserves more respect?


I think we've really covered this before. The difference between the XBox product line and the first XBox product is a fuzzy one that MS can use to their advantage.


You mean when MS chucks a PC in a box?


Those people should just buy a PC with TV out and some decent USB controllers.


It's very hard to write with passion and character about something you don't believe in. Try it some time. Your beliefs colour your writing even when you try to be dispassionate, if they dont, then you are truly detached and probably don't love anything.


No it doesn't make us right, but we have the right to analyse news our way on our site. I'd rather offend some people by stating what I believe, than offend everybody by writing bland, uninteresting slop.

We don't give anybody a free ride at SPOnG, if Sony went back on their word about something, we'd have a go at them. We've been asked to pull stories by all three hardware manufacturers and by several publishers. We've had complaints from every fanboy camp under the sun calling us "my side" bashers and "their side" lovers.

We are naturally distrustful of MS due to their proven record of using illegal tactics to strongarm an industry round to their way of thinking. We have respect for Microsoft for putting in place the best online service of the three platform owners.

We bemoan the fact that Sony seem to allow any old tat onto their platform, not forcing quality control on the publishers. We respect the fact that Sony's hardware, developer relations and marketing has increased the size and worth of the games industry to where it is today.

We are very bemused by the kiddy slant that 90% of Nintendo's games take, a slant they seem to push onto others who publish on their platform. We love Nintendo for the originality of their games and the truly risk-taking approach they take to the industry.

We have similar loves and hates for most of the publishers.

However if one party does more to make us hate them than to love them, of course that's going to come out in our writing. If that's not to other people's tastes, then tough luck, can't please all of the people all of the time. There are plenty of fan sites that will pander to your current likes and dislikes. We hope you'll still read (and post) here, of course, but it's entirely your choice.

How about because we like games, but we know they don't exist in a vacuum? Why should other people's pre-conceived notions of what makes a computer games site affect how we write our news? Why should we not make connections between a company's actions in the games industry to its actions outside of that industry?

Silly examples follow! If EA made Criterion produce a word processing package, wouldn't you like to know? Will this draw resources away from the development of RenderWare? How will this affect the schedule of Burnout4? What if NASA started to use PS3s to drive the shuttle? How about if Sony's TV arm were refusing to accept returns of a faulty product? What if Miamoto-san decided to enter politics and run for office in Japan?

Not to do with the games industry? Not interested?

What if, for example, News Corp. entered the games industry like the scuttlebutt seems to be indicating they will. Do you want us to treat them with kid gloves until their games arm makes a mistake?


The only thing that burns my arse is a right hot curry the night before! :-)

I didn't play Ninja Gaiden because I never got round to it. Suprisingly enough, I don't actually work on SPOnG all day, I work for SPOnG's sister company eleventeenth most of the time and only come to SPOnG in my time off. I also don't just play games when I do get away from the office (there now at 20:52 local time) I have other interests. I don't actually play games that often. I've only just got round to playing "Prince of Persia: The Sands of Time", even though I was sure I'd like it.

That said I play fewer XBox games than PS2 or GameCube, mostly because I don't like the controller. If it's an exceptionally good exclusive game and we get it in, I'll give it a go, but otherwise I don't play most XBox games.

To be honest the rep NG has for being hard has scared me a bit, same with Viewtiful Joe!!


"Those who forget the lessons of history are doomed to repeat it" - I forget who said that, but it's true. If you forget that MS lied, stole and cheated their way to the top of the software industry, you'll allow them to do the same in the games industry.


You know LUPOS, there's no animosity here either, we obviously have serious differences in our world views. Sometimes that's humourous to me, sometimes it winds me up. I think you're the same.

The problem with our rep is that we don't pander to any one camp or point of view, hence everybody who's a camp follower thinks we're against them, because they only get told about times when we diss their camp. As I've said before, we try to be impartial, but we draw on a wider rage of experiences and memories than just the games industry.


Now that's the sort of thing I love reading from you! You genuinely make me laugh on many occaisions.

where to begin... ill start out by trying to make this brief since i only have 20 min till i leave work and neither one of us is going to be changing the others world views today :)

I dont try and write any sort of anything that i woudl claim to be news... i have some particularly strong opiniosn about certain things... and personaly i dont think i would be very good at it because if i wrote abotu somethign i knew anything about (like games lets say) it woudl also be something i feel strongly about. I do harbor a great deal of anamosity twords sony for multiple reasons. not the least of which is the death of what gaming used to be. It's like someone packaged D&D in such a way that my highscool football team started playing it (for those youngsters out there... imagien magic the gathering, except with alot more imagination and creativity and less spenidng money ons tupid cards). Imagine being a nerd ( a stretch for alot fo us im sure) and you livin in some nothign town soemwhere in america, a springfield of sorts, and you are generaly unhappy with your adolesence. Then lets say once a year there is a sci-fi convention (or comic book, or d&d, whatever your prefference), and its probaly the thing you look forward to most each year, right up there with chrstmas! and then one year you go... and you see a bunch of hot girls... the kind that dont talk to you and make you misserabel at school... and a bunch of jocky guys who you hate, and make you misserabel at school. Christmas is ruined... your safe place your refuge... its gone, befouled, your favorite thing in the world, the thing that is most special to you is being used and abused and disgraced by a bunch of ass holes who have no real concern for it what so ever.

-a bit of a dramatazation i realize, but i am tryign to sell my opinions here :) -

Thats what sony did... to me and to millions of others, maybe they aren't as personlay pissed about it as i am, but maybe they should be. I don't care if they did it the odl fashioned way, they ruined my "thing"!

you guys seem to harbor ill will twords M$ because of their improper buisness practices, but there seems to be little or no anamosity about the fact they they basically single handedly turned what a times has shown signs of being a viable art form and turned it into a mass market s**t fest before it ever reached its prime.

I support M$, maybe underdog was a poor choice of words, because they are the anti sony, and i am still full on pissed at sony! Yes they suck too, they suck real bad, maybe even worse, but when sega makes new weird games (gun valkyrie, shenmue2,) they put it on the xbox. When the best designers want to make trully awsome and original games, often times they go to the xbox(ninja gaiden, steel battalion, fable[yes a let down, but peter M. still demands a certain level of respect]) and ocasionaly to the game cube(resident evil 4, that guy threatened to quit when the suggested porting his masterpeice to so sony's POS).

The more i think about it the more i guess im not really concerned that you guys rag on M$, im really concerned that no one seems to care about sony's mis doings.

If i say "windows sucks" because they are pc's peopel say, "use linux", or "buy a mac"... i say sony sucks casue they are ruining games and people say "shut up xbox fan boy!" im not fan of M$, im a big fan of sega and nintendo (maybe im just getting old), but i am a huge anti sony enthusiast! I revel in every stupid thing they do, i shout it from the roof tops.

so there is that...

as for the site, i aprecite it alot, you write it however you want, its working so far, i just feel a few more sub categories may make things better, avoid some of the debate (although i love the debate so maybe i dont support that idea) but thats just me. I still feel you are harded on M$ than sony unfairly, but as i have gone to great lengths to explain, i may be more biased than anyone, the fire in my eyes makes it hard to see clearly.

well its quitin time... im going home.. and you should too (hell its only 5pm here)... stop wasting your time arguing with me... go play some ninja gaiden... its not that hard... and once you get good at it, it is honest god exilerating!



i aims ta please :)

LUPOS, can I presume you consider the Amiga vs MD vs SNES era the golden age for games? If so, I wholeheartedly agree! Although I think this is mainly due to my age at the time - beginning to code, thus appreciating the technical aspects, yet still impressionable - there is no doubt I found games at this time their most magical and majestic.

Hot damn!

I'm gonna invest my weeks cider money in some sony stock! how would i go about aquiring some? Since i got dismissed from my job at goldman-sak 23 years ago due to 'unpleasantness' i've lost touch with the mover's and shakers' in the city

shalom

Dave

in a sense... i dont think there is any real lack of quality games these days, and there certainly wasn't a lack of crap back in the snes/MD/Amiga(where they real a contender?, j/k) either. I just felt like games where the kind of thing that people like me did. peopel who maybe like comics more than the average kid, or maybe dabled in d&d (and rifts, and gurps, and tmnt, and ninjas and superspies, and robotech and ... uh... you know... dabbled ). Now i feel they are no longer being created witht he same market in mind, thats why nintendo is doing as porrly as it is. They may well make some of the best damn games ever, but gta still wins the coveted "spike tv video game of the year award". I don't know about you but when i watched that shows (i must be a sadist) i knew thats what was going to happen but i just couldn't understand why. Not sayign it isnt a good game, definitly not one of my favorites, but it certainly does have its note worthy points. But this is the same year that ninja gaiden was released, possibly the best controlling most perfectly designed game i have EVER played, Riddick a game that took a decent movie license and turned it into an FPS/FPFighter/Stealth/RPG that did evey aspect perfectly and cinimatically. The same year the first Katamari Darmacy comes out, and it gets no recognition whatsoever. to this day tetris is regarded as one of, if not the most, oerfect game ever made. Now someone goes and makes a similarly sublime puzzle experience in a 3d next gen way and there is no recognition by the masses.


im loosing focus here... nintendo and sega are where they are because there arent enough hard core gamers in the world to make up the high production costs of current generation games. The only way you can aford to make games is to sell them to larger markets... that why sonic has more edge than ever before, and Reggi keeps bullshitting abotu nintendo being for adults too... they are both struggling to keep up with the marketting muscle of sony and M$ and EA... they arent dead yet but someday ninty will most likely end up a software (and GBA) co. and sega is already just a shell of its former greatness. Owned by a gambling machine manufacturer.

The industry i helped to create(by buying the stuff, i certainly dont claim any real responsibility for it) has forgotten me and moved on to the money lined shores of pop culture... i'm a sad panda.

Geeze LUPOS, I was expecting something like this, but now I feel like your therapist! :-)

The feelings you outline are common ones amongst a certain generation. I think it's the generation that got big into gaming between the Atari/Sinclair/Commodore era and the PlayStation era. Back when "Nintendo" was a synonym for "video game" in the US.

I'm from the earlier era, I had a C64 when I was 11 (s**t that makes me feel old) and I remember being dissapointed that my hobby didn't get the recognition that I thought it deserved. I'm a fan of Sony for pushing gaming, and by association computing, into the limelight.

The middle era (SNES/MD/Amiga) people saw themselves as rebels. They were an elite club, they did stuff that most people didn't understand. This was the start of mainstream acceptance of gaming. Now there were a few characters in TV shows or films that played video games. These characters were always the rebels or the mis-fits, they resonated with games players in the general population.

Now we are seeing the new era of Playstation and XBox gamers. Lara Croft was on the cover of Face, so gaming is cool! Now I'll do it, plus Orbital does the music, so it's well cool.

Now I do despise these new "casual" gamers, but I also see the market progression as natural. Every new technology has the same three phases. Bleeding edge, leading edge and mainstream. Home computing and home gaming merged for a while, until the death of the Amiga and the rise of the PC led into the current market.

Erm, anyway, not sure where I was going with that, that's the trouble with writing posts over a while and bouncing between work and posting. :-)

OK, I don't think Sony are ruining games on their own, I think they happened to be the company that pushed games into the mainstream. It would have happened sooner or later, Sony are just a good target for you (and others) right now.

I certainly don't think that Sony expanding the market for games is in any way comperable to Microsoft's lying, cheating and stealing to dominate the computing market.

However,as you say, I don't think we are going to change each other's world views here.

just to be sure we all understand each other I never experienced heart break at a con by running in to foot ball players... infact i have never been to a con... actualyl not true i went to one comic con with a friend my freshamn year of college... but that was caus ehe needed somoen to go with him. I am just trying to exemplify my feelings in a painfulyl obvious and easily understandable way.

back to the topic at hand...

i have very mixed emotions about the mainstreaming of gaming because as much as i hate the casual gamers i love the halo2's. Games liek halo2 dont get budgeted if they arent going to sell to a large audeince. I also looove shiny fancy graphics, im a sucker for it, it gives me a rise. At the same time i feel like one of those NYU film students sitting and watching some hugely popular sci-fi movie like the matrix and bitching about how its no where near as good as pi.

I definitly harbor ill will twords sony (and more so EA recently) because they made gaming what it is today. Sony and sega always made top notch inovative hardware, and fantastic games and made enough money from the gammers to keep on making more games for gammers.

as for me feeling like a rebel... i didnt feel liek a rebel.. i was a rebel... i still am... look at me... raging against the machine... from my office... in a manufacturing plant... at a desk... in a uniform... *sigh*. I do think we where rebels, we where liek skaters... that where scared to scrap our knees... and not very coordinated... also i had a c64 and an apple IIe... accpet i was liek 3 and only played that game with the rabbit in the tunnels and some math blaster... not exactly the same experience... in other news...

There is a reason nintendo doesnt think they are loosing... they still make money, they made a beutifull system and actually managed to sell it at a profit while M$ has been taking a loss on ever xbox ever sold. For the big guys its all about software sales... nintendo sells alot of systems and make money, then they sell alot of copies of every game they make, and they make money. if they keep putting out systems at a decent price that they make money off of and keep developing the ony good games for those systems i will happily keep buying whatever they are selling for years to come. The reason games made it to main stream is becasue thats how sony operates (and now M$) its all mild profits and large quantity sales.

Imagine if Nintendo where to start charging 70 bucks a piece for eveygame they make... woudl you not buy the next zelda? id probably pay 100 for that game when it comes out. if thats what it takes to keep getting huge games from smaller companies then that is fine with me. Eventually xbox#'s and ps#'s will be more and more liek computers and computers will become integrated into homes and all apliances and out walls will be giant tv screens... and hopefully there will still be a way to plug my "nintendo supergamebox" into it.

again i have wondered of topic... i dont even know what the point is any more... sony sux... M$ sucks... i wont buy sony as long as it has an 80% market share, and if it switches i wont by M$ either... even they level off ill buy em both... either way i will keep buying nintendo products and anythign sega makes and fighting the good fight.

someday all hardware will eb universal and compatable and standard and hooked together and you probably wont care who make swhat parts, itll be like buying a GE light bulb instead of a sylvania... and then it will trully all be about the games... but then game will all just be wierd vr/mind interface things ... and then movies will start to blend with that because watchign a screen will be inferior to experienciung it for your self... and then movie theaters will disapear... and we will all never go outside... and we will all meet each other in virtual space and it will seem real and even sex woudl happen virtually and you woudlnt know the difference and you wouldn't be able to get disease from it... my train of thought has developed a warp drive!

im goign to have to start a thread called... "if any one gives a crap what lupos thinks check here"... it will be full of 1000 word bitch fests about every news article... then i will put up copies on my own blog... and link to it in my sig... and then i will steal all of your readers... MUAHAHAHAHAHA

i need to go do some work now or something.

Bring it on, buddy, bring it on!!

Besides, your domain has gone!

How would it be if we added a "Rants" forum? Would that give you some sort of release? :-)

son of a bitch! he used the posesive tense of lupo!! i guess i could make luposs.com but since i cant put punctuation in a url i would loose alot of hits to that guy. bastard!
www.lupo-is-a-stupid-name.com
there we go : )

wither way its a waste... no one wants to hear what i have to say... nobody else has posted anything in this thread for some time... i know how to clear a room... i had a few supporters till i went off the handle... plus i dont spell check when im in a hirry and upset and no wants to bother decipher the mess of letters ;P

the best part about your jokes is that you tell them with such a straight face...

It's the Botox. Face like f**kin' C-3PO.

Can you summarise all for your arguments so that I can contribute? I think I've missed most of it.

If I may attempt.

Tyrible said, All your base are belong to Sony.

Loopy say: Microsoft smash all you base.

Tyrible love Sony because they let Linux come to the party.

Loopy hate Sony because they let the uncool kids come to party.

A-f**k*ng-men!

It still scares me how Lupos pretends so well to be dangerously insane, and then he flips into lucidity every now and then, and types EXACTLY what I am thinking.

makes me wonder how close to the edge of sanity you are...

If you're not living on the edge, you're taking up too much room.