In the face of growing support for a boycott of Left 4 Dead 2, Valve has said that the series' remarkably short development cycle is a "special case".
Asked by Gaming Shogun whether the planned November release of L4D2 - just a year after the original - represents a new and "more yearly development cycle", Doug Lombardi (marketing director at Valve) responded in the negative.
"No", said Doug, "it's a special case of Left 4 Dead. The team came off the project with a head full of ideas for what to do next, then they got a lot more feedback once the game went out and was played in the wild. Basically, they sat down, did a whiteboard exercise and set out their plan for the sequel, came in and pitched it to a bunch of us and it seemed like a great idea."
Meanwhile, the Steam group threatening to boycott the game (L4D2 Boycott (NO-L4D2)) is up to nearly 16,000 members at the time of publication - that's in just over a week since the group was formed.
Two of the group's complaints are that "The announced content of Left 4 Dead 2 does not warrant a stand-alone, full-priced sequel and should instead become updates (free or otherwise) for Left 4 Dead", and "Left 4 Dead has not yet received the support and content which Valve has repeatedly stated will be delivered."
A VideoGamer article features Valve co-founder Gabe Newell going on the record with promises of continual support for L4D similar to that provided for Team Fortress 2.
Speaking to Rock, Paper, Shotgun Lombardi defended Valve's support of L4D2, saying, "So, we’ve made a number of releases on the PC, and we made a pretty big release on the 360 in terms of the DLC, and we were able to get out for free which I thought would pretty cool, and it was not an easy thing to pull off. Beyond that, we plan to continue updating Left 4 Dead. We’re not done with that title, it’s not over... I think the short answer is: trust us a little bit."
While Valve might have offered up some DLC for L4D, that didn't come without its own controversy over the timing.
A sizeable chunk of the Steam community obviously isn't feeling that trusting of Valve right now. See GamingShogun's full interview here to decide whether the amount of content being offered warrants a sequel.
Asked by Gaming Shogun whether the planned November release of L4D2 - just a year after the original - represents a new and "more yearly development cycle", Doug Lombardi (marketing director at Valve) responded in the negative.
"No", said Doug, "it's a special case of Left 4 Dead. The team came off the project with a head full of ideas for what to do next, then they got a lot more feedback once the game went out and was played in the wild. Basically, they sat down, did a whiteboard exercise and set out their plan for the sequel, came in and pitched it to a bunch of us and it seemed like a great idea."
Meanwhile, the Steam group threatening to boycott the game (L4D2 Boycott (NO-L4D2)) is up to nearly 16,000 members at the time of publication - that's in just over a week since the group was formed.
Two of the group's complaints are that "The announced content of Left 4 Dead 2 does not warrant a stand-alone, full-priced sequel and should instead become updates (free or otherwise) for Left 4 Dead", and "Left 4 Dead has not yet received the support and content which Valve has repeatedly stated will be delivered."
A VideoGamer article features Valve co-founder Gabe Newell going on the record with promises of continual support for L4D similar to that provided for Team Fortress 2.
Speaking to Rock, Paper, Shotgun Lombardi defended Valve's support of L4D2, saying, "So, we’ve made a number of releases on the PC, and we made a pretty big release on the 360 in terms of the DLC, and we were able to get out for free which I thought would pretty cool, and it was not an easy thing to pull off. Beyond that, we plan to continue updating Left 4 Dead. We’re not done with that title, it’s not over... I think the short answer is: trust us a little bit."
While Valve might have offered up some DLC for L4D, that didn't come without its own controversy over the timing.
A sizeable chunk of the Steam community obviously isn't feeling that trusting of Valve right now. See GamingShogun's full interview here to decide whether the amount of content being offered warrants a sequel.
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Comments
anim3z0mbi3 8 Jun 2009 14:27
1/9
FIRST! sorry, couldn't resist.
I really do agree that we should just trust valve a bit, just look at TF2. Plus, how can L4D2 not be fun?! its more zombie killing, brain smashing, molotov-throwing action! plus, there's the addition of melee weapons and additional zombie types, such as the wandering witch. i think this game will be great, and that there really will be more content for L4D1, we just need to trust valve.
I really do agree that we should just trust valve a bit, just look at TF2. Plus, how can L4D2 not be fun?! its more zombie killing, brain smashing, molotov-throwing action! plus, there's the addition of melee weapons and additional zombie types, such as the wandering witch. i think this game will be great, and that there really will be more content for L4D1, we just need to trust valve.
Steviepunk 8 Jun 2009 17:45
2/9
I just find it funny that a lot of the people that are whining about this are the same people that spend many hours each week playing the game and they are trying to claim that there wasn't enough content in the original game to justify the full retail price so they should be getting this for free!!
Despite Valve asking for a little trust in what they are doing, so many seem so intent on giving none, despite everything that Valve has given them over the years. It's at times like this I'm ashamed to be a gamer.
Despite Valve asking for a little trust in what they are doing, so many seem so intent on giving none, despite everything that Valve has given them over the years. It's at times like this I'm ashamed to be a gamer.
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Awesome Fool 8 Jun 2009 18:11
3/9
I don't understand what all the fuss is about, all the talk on boycotting the game? That's rediculous. Besides, there will be no boycotting, they'll buy it, they just want to have a good grumble about something that's not grumble worthy!
Awesome Fool
http://www.Project-Natal.com
Awesome Fool
http://www.Project-Natal.com
OptimusP 8 Jun 2009 19:09
4/9
Still, I would like to see it released as an add-on pack, the same thing with SMG2, Halo ODST and other "sequels"
Hell, the CoD4 single player should have been an add-on pack, man was that thing short and completly void of anything interesting.
Hell, the CoD4 single player should have been an add-on pack, man was that thing short and completly void of anything interesting.
Akane 9 Jun 2009 02:03
5/9
So he admits that L4D is a full priced beta?
Hyper 9 Jun 2009 02:19
6/9
Now that my initial anger has worn off, I guess it's time to be a bit more rational about the news of the L4D sequel. After thinking about it (and looking at my stats in the game), I got my moneys worth out of L4D 10 times over and I will continue to play it more in future once I'm a bit less bored of it and more community made maps become available.
I think some of the commenters on the boycott page hit the nail on the head about why a lot of people are so mad about this. It's not about content because we pay more for less all the time. Who here bought the Orange Box even though you had half the games in it? I did. We buy the Half Life sequels and don't make a peep (while crying for more) because that's how the game was marketed to us. For me, I just don't like the look of L4D2 or the new characters. Even if the new game was released as a paid DLC or as an expansion pack, I don't think I'd get it right off the hop based on what I've seen so far. If I bought it at all I'd probably just wait until it went on sale so I don't feel like I was f**ked in the ass like I did with L4D when the updates and SDK release dates just kept getting pushed back. Not to mention that L4D2 doesn't really have the same 'Holy s**t! I need that game!' factor L4D had for me.
It's too much like the original without the character continuity like in other sequels. Would you have bought Tomb Raider 2, 3, 5, 100, 1000 without Lara Croft jiggling around in it? I doubt it. Or HALO without Master Chief? Unlikely. You get to know the characters and even though fictional, they become like a friend that you can kick some zombie, alien, mummy, etc ass with. The new L4D characters are either boring/stupid hicks or cheesy caricatures of the worst possible types of people
Unlikely in-game dialog:
Player 1: “I wanna be the fat black guy!!!”
Player 2: “NOOOOO!!! I want to!!!! You can be the scrawny cracker that sounds like he was dropped on his head as a baby!”
Player 3: “Piss on you, I'm going to be the sleaze-ball in the Miami Vice suit that's too big for him”
Player 4: “I LOVE playing the whiny black chick!”
Uh... Yeah, right...
If you don't know what I'm talking about, check out the game play videos on Youtube: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dNHwr6fpAC8&feature=channel
As for the new 'stuff', yeah, there's some neat s**t. But I haven't seen anything that looks like it couldn't be implemented in the current game. I'm sure within weeks of L4D2 being released the mod community will be porting those items into L4D without too much difficulty. Maybe Valve will do that so we don't have to.
I think some of the commenters on the boycott page hit the nail on the head about why a lot of people are so mad about this. It's not about content because we pay more for less all the time. Who here bought the Orange Box even though you had half the games in it? I did. We buy the Half Life sequels and don't make a peep (while crying for more) because that's how the game was marketed to us. For me, I just don't like the look of L4D2 or the new characters. Even if the new game was released as a paid DLC or as an expansion pack, I don't think I'd get it right off the hop based on what I've seen so far. If I bought it at all I'd probably just wait until it went on sale so I don't feel like I was f**ked in the ass like I did with L4D when the updates and SDK release dates just kept getting pushed back. Not to mention that L4D2 doesn't really have the same 'Holy s**t! I need that game!' factor L4D had for me.
It's too much like the original without the character continuity like in other sequels. Would you have bought Tomb Raider 2, 3, 5, 100, 1000 without Lara Croft jiggling around in it? I doubt it. Or HALO without Master Chief? Unlikely. You get to know the characters and even though fictional, they become like a friend that you can kick some zombie, alien, mummy, etc ass with. The new L4D characters are either boring/stupid hicks or cheesy caricatures of the worst possible types of people
Unlikely in-game dialog:
Player 1: “I wanna be the fat black guy!!!”
Player 2: “NOOOOO!!! I want to!!!! You can be the scrawny cracker that sounds like he was dropped on his head as a baby!”
Player 3: “Piss on you, I'm going to be the sleaze-ball in the Miami Vice suit that's too big for him”
Player 4: “I LOVE playing the whiny black chick!”
Uh... Yeah, right...
If you don't know what I'm talking about, check out the game play videos on Youtube: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dNHwr6fpAC8&feature=channel
As for the new 'stuff', yeah, there's some neat s**t. But I haven't seen anything that looks like it couldn't be implemented in the current game. I'm sure within weeks of L4D2 being released the mod community will be porting those items into L4D without too much difficulty. Maybe Valve will do that so we don't have to.
Rad 9 Jun 2009 03:04
7/9
@Steviepunk
Have I gotten my $50 worth of L4D? Sure. But that is not the point.
Would I pay $50 for a L4D 2? Sure. But even that is not the point.
The point is that most gamers made the purchase of L4D under the assumption [which was grounded in the evidence of Valve's statements] about how the DLC would come out faster for L4D and how there would be plenty of it.
It hasn’t. Making allegations as to how much a section of the L4D community has played the game has nothing whatsoever to do with the issue at hand which is Valve's broken promises and misleading advertising.
Have I gotten my $50 worth of L4D? Sure. But that is not the point.
Would I pay $50 for a L4D 2? Sure. But even that is not the point.
The point is that most gamers made the purchase of L4D under the assumption [which was grounded in the evidence of Valve's statements] about how the DLC would come out faster for L4D and how there would be plenty of it.
It hasn’t. Making allegations as to how much a section of the L4D community has played the game has nothing whatsoever to do with the issue at hand which is Valve's broken promises and misleading advertising.
OptimusP 9 Jun 2009 08:15
8/9
Rad wrote:
@Steviepunk
Have I gotten my $50 worth of L4D? Sure. But that is not the point.
Would I pay $50 for a L4D 2? Sure. But even that is not the point.
Have I gotten my $50 worth of L4D? Sure. But that is not the point.
Would I pay $50 for a L4D 2? Sure. But even that is not the point.
I'm going to add the actual point what bugs a lot of people.
Would i pay 50 bucks for L4D 2 if it was actually L4D 1, yeah sure, but since L4D 1 allready exists...
NSA HWD 13 Jun 2009 02:56
9/9
The one group of people that seems to be missing in most of the comments on the boycott group site and the articles on the web are the server owners.
As a server owner, I support L4D by paying for 4 West Coast servers out of my own pocket that have had in total roughly 17000 players since they were started 4 months ago. As well, I work for a server company that provides numerous servers for TF2, L4D, CS:S and other Valve games.
One disturbing trend I have seen is the daily cancellation of L4D servers. Since the 'Survival Pack' the company I work for has seen a 70% increase in server cancellations of servers that service Central North America and the West Coast. That number increases daily.
The biggest drop was right after the 'Survival Pack' when people began to realize how minor the changes actually were. Most people played Survival mode until they got the achievements and then moved back to Co-op or Versus. We lost 45% of the servers within days of that release.
The second spike was right after the news about L4D2. That was about 20% of the servers. The other 5% has been just due to attrition since the DLC was released.
Now, obviously there have been new servers started, but the total loss of server coverage totals about 70% in the company I work for, and I work for a s**tty little hole in the wall no one even knows about. In actual numbers that means about 110 servers are now shut down in the past couple months with my employer alone. I wonder how this has affected Gameservers or Darkstar.
I should mention that most of the people canceling servers have been very vocal about why they're canceling them, and I agree with the majority of their reasons, especially about the release of L4D2.
So, I pose this question to you, do you think splitting the games community base will increase or decrease the number of servers for both games?
Secondly, do you think server owners that are canceling their servers will be rushing out to start a L4D2 server after they feel that they've been burned by Valve?
The answers are pretty obvious.
All you flame-baiters screaming about the boycott group being a bunch of whining retards might want to think about that, because without the server owners, you'd have no where to play either game.
As for myself, I don't have any choice but to 'get' the game since it's purchased for me by my employer for troubleshooting and testing. However, I'll be shutting down my servers the day L4D2 is released unless both games can be serviced by a single server and other significant issues about the release of L4D2 are satisfactorily dealt with by Valve.
As a server owner, I support L4D by paying for 4 West Coast servers out of my own pocket that have had in total roughly 17000 players since they were started 4 months ago. As well, I work for a server company that provides numerous servers for TF2, L4D, CS:S and other Valve games.
One disturbing trend I have seen is the daily cancellation of L4D servers. Since the 'Survival Pack' the company I work for has seen a 70% increase in server cancellations of servers that service Central North America and the West Coast. That number increases daily.
The biggest drop was right after the 'Survival Pack' when people began to realize how minor the changes actually were. Most people played Survival mode until they got the achievements and then moved back to Co-op or Versus. We lost 45% of the servers within days of that release.
The second spike was right after the news about L4D2. That was about 20% of the servers. The other 5% has been just due to attrition since the DLC was released.
Now, obviously there have been new servers started, but the total loss of server coverage totals about 70% in the company I work for, and I work for a s**tty little hole in the wall no one even knows about. In actual numbers that means about 110 servers are now shut down in the past couple months with my employer alone. I wonder how this has affected Gameservers or Darkstar.
I should mention that most of the people canceling servers have been very vocal about why they're canceling them, and I agree with the majority of their reasons, especially about the release of L4D2.
So, I pose this question to you, do you think splitting the games community base will increase or decrease the number of servers for both games?
Secondly, do you think server owners that are canceling their servers will be rushing out to start a L4D2 server after they feel that they've been burned by Valve?
The answers are pretty obvious.
All you flame-baiters screaming about the boycott group being a bunch of whining retards might want to think about that, because without the server owners, you'd have no where to play either game.
As for myself, I don't have any choice but to 'get' the game since it's purchased for me by my employer for troubleshooting and testing. However, I'll be shutting down my servers the day L4D2 is released unless both games can be serviced by a single server and other significant issues about the release of L4D2 are satisfactorily dealt with by Valve.